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[+] When's the last time you prayed like this?
Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:12 pm
Scott Mc
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Joined: 12 Aug 2004
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Location: E Nash




When is the last time you prayed to God for something big AND expected it to happen. After a conversation here at work today, I realized I pray with an attitude more like I know God could do it, but don't believe he will do it. Just to clarify, I mean this question to be about really praying with faith, not praying expecting to "get" something.

To answer my own question...it has been quite some time. I am not sure that I can even remember.

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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 5:30 pm
shawn
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It's interesting that you bring this up. i was just talking to Leslie last night about something similar to this. i have hope and some faith, but my expectations don't always match these things. sometimes when i get discouraged by people, my faith that God is going to do something big deminishes some.

i've seen God do huge things, and i know He will when He chooses to, but my faith and actions don't always reflect this.

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Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2005 10:56 pm
Indie
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Joined: 14 Aug 2004
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Location: lost and confused




I do feel somewhat uncomfortable with this as I would rather expect that God will answer than expect that what I want to happen will happen. I would like to do more listening prayer, giving God a chance to speak rather than doing all of the speaking myself.

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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 9:10 am
Scott Mc
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Joined: 12 Aug 2004
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Location: E Nash




Great points Shawn and Indie.

Indie, I really appreciate your idea about listening prayer. I think you are right on about that. In our day and culture, this is almost counter-intuitive. We've got to be doing something. We've got to be getting somewhere or defining something.

I should have said that my initial question was semi-specifically referring to "intercessory" type prayer or something like that. I think for me I'm saying that I underestimate God and I limit him by measuring him against my own abilities. Or I pray out of a somewhat legalistic mindset...not with the mind of Moses, Elisha, Paul...or Jesus --- entreating God for great intervention and really thinking it could happen. Maybe that would be a better word to say than expect it to happen.

[+] raising the dead
Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 2:56 pm
yasheluah
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Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 50




i think the last time i prayed like that was when i was praying next to my friend's body as it lay in a casket.

he committed suicide in august... really long story (that i don't mind sharing sometime if there are those interested).

i truly believed that God would raise noah up, right there, in that funeral parlor. "facts" like enbalming fluid and decomposition didn't matter. i could see it happening, i knew it could happen because God has done it before. i have seen Him miraculously heal people before-- mentally, emotionally, physically. imagine what an amazing story noah would have, the people he could impact, the glory that God could receive...

but then i thought, well... he kind of chose to take himself out of this world, so would he have to choose to come back to it? and if that is the case... why would he choose to come back here when being in the physical presence of Christ is so much better (i firmly believe he was a Christ follower)...

so, God did not raise my friend from the dead. but i know He could have... and i really don't think it matters why He didn't. He knows best.

i wish i could pray like that for everything that goes on in my life... i wish it didn't take such an enormous tragedy to move me to such faith.

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[+] I don't get intercessory prayer
Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2005 4:47 pm
astrotoby
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Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 93
Location: earth




I don't really pray like this. I never have and I don't expect I ever will. It doesn't really jive with my fatalistic worldview.

In fact the basic idea of prayer as a whole pretty much eludes me. At least as far as intercessary type prayer. I like the fact that we can communicate with God, but we can't really change the outcome of things by praying for them.

And why would we want to? Do we imagine we know more about how a particular situation should turn out than God? God made the whole thing, and everything involved, and already knows how it's going to turn out, so I don't really get the point.

Talking to God is cool, but trying to influence him to make decisions differently than he would have if we didn't bug him about it seems crazy. He's God, for God sakes, not me.

I'll tell him what I wish would happen, and I'll pray for his will to be done. But the bottom line is that I think he should just go ahead and make the call himself.

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Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:56 pm
noir
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Location: those mean streets




yasheluah, i'm sorry that your friend committed suicide. i had someone very close to me commit suicide a few years ago. it's a horrible thing to have to go through. i hope God will bring healing to you and those who knew him.

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Posted: Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:04 pm
yasheluah
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Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 50




thank you noir... it's rough, isn't it? i'd known him almost 10 years. he constantly struggled through his short 22 years on earth. he had attempted 2 other times in the past, one with pills and one with a gun. this time it was hanging.

he was diagnosed with bipolar when he was a young teen... he was in several hospitals and rehab centers, one of which i would go visit him at. he got into drugs and made some pretty bad choices, and the church we went to banned him from even going on the property-- i thought it was the biggest load of crap ever, and i determined to be his friend no matter what through all that. he was homeless on the streets of berkeley, new york, somewhere in canada even... and finally came home-- and clean-- around this time last year.

what might be most frustrating about noah dying is that he had really been making an impact in the world around him in ways that no one else really could. he knew what it was to be a drug addict, he knew what it was to be homeless. and i am so thankful for the short months i had with him, getting to learn from him and watch how he interacted with people that were on the path he was... he oozed love.

the only way i can explain the change in him is God... and then he killed himself. i don't know that i'll ever really understand what all was going through his mind; normally he would call me when he was down and stuff, but he didn't that time (i was actually here in nashville visiting aaron for the first time). he didn't leave a note or anything. so there's a lot of unresolved mystery, but God's peace covers over that, for me.

i'm pretty close with noah's parents, they are amazing individuals, and seem to be dealing with everything as best as one could expect. i admire them more than they'll ever know. they lived out the love of Christ to their son.

it's funny how the thing i take away from the whole ordeal the most is love. i think that is definitely a God thing.

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the beauty of grace is that it makes life not fair.

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